Forum of Lithuanian History

Forum of Lithuanian history is a place for discussion on the urgent problems of the Lithuanian history. Share your opinions!

Moderator of the forum - Tomas Baranauskas

Our website - Medieval Lithuania

[ Taisyklės ] [ Правила ] [ Rules ]

Medieval Lithuania
Search | User Listing Forums | Calendars | Albums | Quotes | Skins | Language
You are logged in as a guest. ( logon | register )

Random quote: "Everyone is necessarily the hero of his own life story." John Barth (1930 - )
- (Added by: Tomas Baranauskas)

Lithuanian language area acc. to Kurschat 1876

View previous thread :: View next thread
  Frozen      FORUMS -> Forum of Lithuanian history Message format 
Posted 2007-03-19 17:31 (#43467 - in reply to #43301)
Subject: RE: Lithuanian language area acc. to Kurschat 187

mantas - 2007-03-09 9:26 PM

incognito - 2007-02-05 12:44 PM
Seems, You are right Mr. Lutz Szemkus. 

I bet you knew dear Mr Lutz Szemkus is right long before you opened his message
Also, your famous revolutionary dotted map undisputely means that - ? That... Well, that you know how to put pixels
on east-prussian map All this makes you scientist and flexible theoretician. Now you can officially claim
something that wasnt.
Go inkognito! 

Why this map is revoliutionary? There is nothing revolution in it, simply I can only repeat: prussian lithuanians indeed used such terms: gudai and žemaičiai. And this can't be due division of Lithuania into Polish and Russian Lithuania's, as forumist Velnias thinks. Because such division appeared only in 1815 after Vienna Congress when Kingdom of Poland was created. Indeed lithuanians could name poles as gudai, but the were no massive migration of poles, neither the was migration of other lithuanians into Prussia in 19 century. In 19 century only some russian old believers settled in East Prussia, they are slaves to, of course, be gudai too, but they settled in Masuria. Forumist Velnias thinks toponyms gudai appeared due dialectical differencies, but this hard to be, because: 1. prussian lithuanians for persons with different subdialects named according place where they came from: tilžėnai, raigainėnai. 2. Among prussian lithuanians dialect diversity in 19 century was lesser neither between lithuanians of Lithuania Major.
"Tokius striukius žmonės paprastai vadindavo tilžėnais, Tačiau Zinkevičius pastebi, kad tarminė diferianciacija buvusi mažesnė negu Lietuvos valstybėje, nes ir plotas čai buvęs mažesnis."

If still not understood, what this map means - let's compare toponyms that named after latvians in Lithuania and use this analogy. So I'd found 10 toponyms
1. Latveliškiai, Joniškis rayon, Kriukai seniorship.
2. Latveliškis, Biržai r. Pabiržės sen.
3. Latveliškis, Zarasai r., Dusetai sen.
4. Latveliai, Biržai r., Parovëja sen.
5. Latveliai, Rokiškis r. Pandëlys sen.
6. Latveliai, Kretinga r., Darbënai sen.
7. Žarėnai-Latveliai, Šiauliai r. Šakyna sen.
8. Latvygala, Biržai r., Papilys sen.
9. Latviai, Elektrėnai sen.
10. Latviai, Molėtai r., Giedraičiai sen.
And one trend is clear - majority of toponyms with Latv- are located near the border with Latvia. Logically! So the same rule is in Prussia's part - Lithuania Minor. Toponyms with Gud-, Szameit- are located mainly near border with Lithuania! Don't forget lithuanian language in 16 century was spread much wider, even to Frischess Haff, there were even prussian lithuanians who spoke in dzukian dialect (weird dialect), prussian lithuanians bordered with masurians (so they could be named as gudai too, because they spoke in polish) - so there should be much more toponyms with Gud- , much more in various parts of East Prussia. But why they are located near Lithuania Major? Why there are much surnames among prussian lithuanians with Gud-?

Edited by incognito 2007-03-19 17:40


Attachments latveliai_map.jpg (42KB - 77 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page

Jump to forum :
Search this forum
E-mail a link to this thread


(Delete all cookies set by this site)
Running MegaBBS ASP Forum Software
© 2002-2019 PD9 Software