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Lithuanian circular of 1578
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Herkus
Posted 2009-04-30 05:24 (#61074 - in reply to #61040)
Subject: RE: del atleidima sawa ghreku


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incognito - 2009-04-29 3:06 PM

For me it's unimportant, but I hate the lie. And the fact, it is Lithuanian historians pro and amateur who still lying that Lithuanians were the first who setled, or Scaloavians and Nadrovians were... Lithuanains, and so on, so on... The last falsification I saw was shocking! According Mažosios Lietuvos Enciklopedija (no doubt propagandistic source) claims - the entry about Prussian Lithuania says such thing: "it is the way how in pre-WW1 was named East Prussia"... No surprise, that time after time appears brainwashed Lithuanians, maybe even sincere people, with warious claims... 


I hate the lie, too. But to be honest, who can say to know the truth about the situation that lies now almost 1000 years in the past?. We can only get close to it through logic research and assumptions. And as far as this research goes, it seems to be, that there were no real borders between old prussian country and lithuanian country. Inbetween were wilderness, and who could say which parts were lithuanians living and were old prussians? It was a completely different world at this time. The wilderness, were no human mind was living, was much bigger than the small areas were humans were constantly living, and nobody cared about nationality in that time.
Of course there is and ever has been a lot of propaganda. There are also people in Germany that still consider Eastprussia as a main german country and that there ever settled germans and they deny any polish or lithuanian influence in this area. Of course the last german generation that were born in this area (and is still alive today), has only small rememberance of this time and they only witnessed the last years, were those non-german influences were almost dead. Even the old citizens of Tolmingkehmen who are still alive today, have never heard anything about Donelaitis and were surprised, that in their old church were they were personally baptized, is now a museum about a lithuanian guy!
This is of course as wrong as lithuanians which are assuming that Eastprussia was a lithuanian province that was occupied by germans.


You made few mistakes. Prussians are Germans like Bavarians, Schwabians, Saxons etc. If You have in mind so called Old Prussians I have to remind that they not named themselves neither Old Prussians, nor Prussians before conquest. It was exonym.  

ok, of course I meant not the "german" prussians, but the original prussians. In german language we have diiferent words for them. ("Preußen" stand for the german ones, and "Prussen"or "Pruzzen" for the baltic ones. I don't know how they are seperated in english language. Actually there are existing a few romantic idiots that are claiming to be members of the old prussian tribe, and they asked to be confirmed as an offically minority in Germany and the EU. This is really ridicoulous as the real old prussian tribe is dead since at least 300 years. It is another try to get acknowledged their right of an own country, since they don't have one as german Eastprussians.


What You said is another propaganda, created in Soviet times... And many, including Lithuanians, were catched on this. After all this blah blah blah was ommitted the fact that this region belongs to the Soviet Union... which is neither have connections with Teutonic Knights, nor with so called Old Prussians. 


The area that used to be (east)prussia / mazoji lietuva in history, is now part of Russia, and that is no propaganda. It is reality, since at least more than 50 years. And of course the soviets/russians have no real historic rights to this area , but that doesn't help that the reality is now that Kaliningrad, Sovjetsk and so on, ARE soviet/russian cities. And Elblag, Olsztyn, Goldap are now polish cities as much as Klaipeda and Silute are lithuanian cities. At least poles and lithuanians can claim historic rights to this areas. This area has a german past, but a russian/polish/lithuanian future. Thats the price for the crimes that Germany has done in WW2. I don't want to know the future if the germans would have won the war, instead of the allies...They would have done even more historically not correct campaigns.
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